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Surge of Koth\'s Chimera

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Chimeric MassEnlarge

Chimeric Mass

{X}

Artifact

Scars of Mirrodin

Read rules for Chimeric Mass
This artifact enters with X charge counters on it. {1}: Until end of turn, this artifact becomes a Construct artifact creature with "This creature's power and toughness are each equal to the number of charge counters on it."

Full card details & printings ›

Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 9:21 am

Squillis
Posts: 424
Joined: 20-Nov-08


With Koth and 5 mountains out and Increasing Vengeance in the G/Y,

Activate Koth's ability to add RRRRR to your mana pool and tap all but 1 of your lands 
Cast Geosurge
Respond to Geosurge by casting Increasing Vengeance from G/Y for its Flashback cost targeting Geosurge <(0) in pool>
Increasing Vengeance resolves copying Geosurge twice <(0) in your pool>
Geosurge resolves adding RRRRRRR to your pool only for artifact/creature spells
Geosurge resolves adding RRRRRRR to your pool only for artifact/creature spells
Geosurge resolves adding RRRRRRR to your pool only for artifact/creature spells
Use the mana to cast Chimeric Mass with 21 counters
If your opponent attacks during your turn you can use the mountain you have untapped to activate the Mass and block if you're not worried about sorcery-speed removal.

It's one creature that's hard to get rid of with sorcery-speed removal and has no evasion so isn't perfect but there are other standard-legal cards that can make this run smoother like Urabrask the Hidden making the Chimeric Mass hastey when activated.


[Edited by Squillis on 23/May/12 at 9:37AM]
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 9:44am

Skybreak22
Posts: 327
Joined: 01-Feb-10

Evidently, they have now added the all new cards to the database. I like the combo. "Almost" as good as my Lightning Serpent combo.....lol. ;)
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 10:03am

Squillis
Posts: 424
Joined: 20-Nov-08

Actually, they haven't added the cards yet, I'm just a little bit of a code junky so I modified the post to include the pictures.  For instructions how to do this see my post at http://www.mtgcombos.com/view.php?fid=1&tid=57963
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 11:59am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Nice one!
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 2:17pm

Skybreak22
Posts: 327
Joined: 01-Feb-10

Hey Squillis.....I normally ask Gericault this stuff cause he's the "rules master", but I thought you may know this.... If you have Increasing Vengeance in your graveyard, and you cast Exhaustion, then use Inc.Vengeance flashback for two copies....would this trigger a 3-turn Exhaustion the same way multiple Yosei's abilities stack opponent upkeeps? I'm thinking it would but I wanted to get another opinion.
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 2:33pm

TheCaptain
Posts: 909
Joined: 13-Apr-11

Skybreak,

I believe I can help you out there. There's a key difference between the wording on Yosei and Exhaustion. Yosei says "target player SKIPS his or her next untap step", whereas Exhaustion says that "creatures and lands don't untap during target opponent's NEXT untap step".

So multiple Yosei's work like this - if two triggers are on the stack, one resolves, making a player skip his or her next untap step. WHen the second trigger goes to resolve, the next untap step for that player would be two turns later, since the other one has already been skipped. You can't skip the same thing twice. Exhaustion doesn't ask to skip, it just modifies how the next untap works. Each resolution of Exhaustion can act together without any contradiction.

So in short, copying exhaustion would not cause opponents to lose more than one untap step, unlike having multiple Yoseis.
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 2:40pm

Squillis
Posts: 424
Joined: 20-Nov-08

I believe it won't setup a 3-turn delay, though need to get the official answer.  The ability has two parts, the effect and the duration.  Because the duration isn't dependant on a condition beyond the 'next untap step', they will all look for the player's "next untap step" to intervene.  They are not replacement effects (don't contain the word 'instead' or 'if <condition>, then') so they cannot be ordered and wait around for the following turn.  All they do is setup 3 redundant new gamerules that state a player can't untap the permanents of those qualities during their uptap step, the rules only apply to that one untap step though.  I'll get back to you with the Official answer.
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 2:54pm

Squillis
Posts: 424
Joined: 20-Nov-08

Here's the answer when I posted it to a rules forum:

"You're correct for the reasons stated. The answer would be different if the effect had them skip their untap step.

__________________
Level 3 Magic Judge"

I think the Level 3 Judge has a little better rules knowledge than I do ;)
Date Posted: Wed May/23/12 at 3:00pm

Skybreak22
Posts: 327
Joined: 01-Feb-10

Yeah I guess the wording on Exhaustion doesn't skip untap steps. Guess I need to dig a little deeper to make that work. Thanks for the input.
Date Posted: Thu May/24/12 at 6:16pm

Jesscrazy
Posts: 70
Joined: 30-Mar-11

Or cast banefire with the 21 mana... Seems better in red to just smack them in the face with 20 damage than to make a 21/21 vanilla creature that can be Disenchanted.
Date Posted: Fri May/25/12 at 7:37am

Squillis
Posts: 424
Joined: 20-Nov-08

I thought of the Banefire idea too, but it wouldn't work.  Banefire can't be cast off of the mana from Geosurge and Geosurge produces 21 of the 22 mana you're using for this.