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red infinite turns

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Isochron ScepterEnlarge

Isochron Scepter

{2}

Artifact

Mirrodin

Read rules for Isochron Scepter
Imprint — When this artifact enters, you may exile an instant card with mana value 2 or less from your hand. {2}, {T}: You may copy the exiled card. If you do, you may cast the copy without paying its mana cost.

Full card details & printings ›

Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 8:17 am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

use 2 isochron scepters, imprinting final fortune on one and stifle on the other. tap 2 to take an extra turn, and at the end of the turn use stifle to prevent your loss of the game. repeat for infinite turns.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 8:45am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

I know that you can't can't Stifle only the end of the ability, but this may work, because the ability activates at a different time. I couldn't find the rulings.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 9:21am

rav514
Posts: 329
Joined: 02-Dec-10

it works. the trigger become independant of the card and can be targeted when it gets put on the stack.

You could just use one scepter and sun dial of the infinate and be true mono red
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:02am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

your right, now that i think about it, sundial of the infinite works way better. It would also makes this a more edh accessible combo
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:07am

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

That's a good call! I may have to put the threesome in my Bosh or Jor Kadeen deck...
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:11am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

i been wondering, are memnarch and bosh legal generals? i continue to get conflicting reports on whether or not general legality is determined by mana cost or simply mana present in the cards text.

jor kadeen is terrific.


[Edited by Starship on 16/Dec/11 at 10:14AM]
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:19am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

They are legal, but you have to stay in colorless.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:21am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

that sounds reasonable, i really wish that i could make a blue memnarch deck though.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:24am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

I think that the only banned generals are Braids and some Elf.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:32am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

yeah black braids and rofellos are banned, and i can definitely understand why.


[Edited by Starship on 16/Dec/11 at 10:37AM]
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:36am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Braids set up a lock too quickly and commonly. Rofellos probably just made Elves too fast.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:38am

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

Recent rule added color to your general/commander if the mana symbol is in the rules text. Thus, Bosh can use red, Thelon Havenwood can use black, Memnarch can use blue...

From mtgcommander:

A card's colour identity is its colour plus the colour of any mana symbols in the card's rules text. A card's colour identity is established before the game begins, and cannot be changed by game effects.


[Edited by Pal-of-Lim-Dul on 16/Dec/11 at 10:41AM]
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:39am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

sweat! if this is true then i am definitely making a memnarch deck.


[Edited by Starship on 16/Dec/11 at 10:43AM]
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:42am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

That opens many of possibles. (evil laugh and crash of lightning/thunder)
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 10:46am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

actually i been thinking about making a mono blue wizard edh. mostly i've been debating on azami and arcanis, but memnarch might work well too. lol this opens up a bunch of cool possibilities.


[Edited by Starship on 16/Dec/11 at 10:50AM]
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 12:04pm

rav514
Posts: 329
Joined: 02-Dec-10

i made a edh wizard deck, used ertia the corrupted as general. works quite well as long as i don't get bum rushed
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 1:02pm

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

my deck is mostly based around draw power to help me pull off some sweat damage combos. ertai is definitely cool, but i'm not sure how affective he would be as my general.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 1:11pm

Goemon
Posts: 46
Joined: 23-Nov-11

you can sobstitute 1 stifle + 1 isochron scepter with a sundial of the infinite.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 1:13pm

rav514
Posts: 329
Joined: 02-Dec-10

i played it close to the vest. it works by getting ppl to attack other opponents. kinda like political puppets, except w/o the annoying never ending game aspect. i used a lot of draw/enchantment search/ and bounce. I think the biggest combo i run is phryxian unlife and repay in kind. It's just a control deck trying to speed up everyone elses death instead of slowing the game down. Different style, nothing more. Good luck with ur version.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 2:19pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Goemon, read the previous posts. Rav already said that.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 2:38pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

@pal
I was going to say that!

Also, erayo is now banned!
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:09pm

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

actually, i just looked it up. as far as i can tell, you can't use sundial of the infinite even though it ends the stack. the effect that causes you to lose the game triggers when the turn ends, and the sundial ends the turn, in effect losing you the game. if this isn't true, someone please tell me differently, but as far as i can tell it just can't work.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:15pm

rav514
Posts: 329
Joined: 02-Dec-10

your both right and wrong. It depends WHEN u use sundial. Since final fortune creates a trigger that loses the game when you end your turn that trigger will go on the stack no matter what device you use to end your turn. Which causes you to lose the game. How ever, if you end your end normally and wait for the lose game trigger to go on the stack, you can repsond to the trigger with the sundial thus immeadately ending your turn and exiling everything on the stack which includes the trigger for you to lose the game thus avoiding the lose game effect and cheating ur way to infinite turns.

[Edited by rav514 on 16/Dec/11 at 3:17PM]
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:17pm

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

so it would be in response to losing?
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:18pm

rav514
Posts: 329
Joined: 02-Dec-10

Yes, in response to losing the game i end my turn. which exiles the lose game effect/trigger.

EDIT, you could also you timestop but that wouldn't be repeatable and be much more expensive mana wise.



[Edited by rav514 on 16/Dec/11 at 3:21PM]
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:20pm

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

could you use leyline of anticipation and platinum angel in the same way?
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:21pm

rav514
Posts: 329
Joined: 02-Dec-10

don't see y not. You can play any fast effect you want.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:25pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

You dont need leyline, you only need the angel!
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:39pm

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

you would need the leyline to get it out though, if it wasn't already in play. in the case of this combo, yes, platinum angel would prevent you from losing.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 3:40pm

rav514
Posts: 329
Joined: 02-Dec-10

i think he meant as a response to losing.

This is the confusing part. State based actions lose you the game. Everything else is just an effect. It's not taking 20 damage that kills you. It's the state based check after, that goes " ohh you got zero life (or what ever lose game condition you have), die F&%*%r!!!!".

Look up angel's grace (i believe) 1 white mana, instant, you can't lose the game this turn. If you played that one elses turn still be "alive" till the first stack item resolves at the beginning of the next upkeep cause that's when the next state based action is check. It's wierd cause you'd be "alive" even though you've clearly triggered a lose game effect.

The really funny part is if the first thing to resolve some how prevents you from having another lose game condition, you survive. It's kinda like walking on lava, Why aren't you dead?

However, if your opponent play's ANYTHING on the top of the stack, when his card is done resolving the game will check you for a lose game condition and off ur a$$.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 6:03pm

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

makes sense. angel's grace works just as well as stifle in this situation. lol
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 6:28pm

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

@Starship regarding Arcanis as Commander. I have that deck built up. I threw in as many cards that are positively affected by card draw and hand size. That deck is redonkulous. I only bring him out in a game where there are obvious DB generals.
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 6:30pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

I know someone with an arcanis deck that combos and is just generally stupid! Especially when he goes t1 land, sol ring, helm of awakening 2 GAMES IN A ROW!
Date Posted: Fri Dec/16/11 at 6:45pm

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

yo Lim-Dul, do have any suggestions?

also, i'm currently sleeving my new Jhoira deck, f-yeah!

[Edited by on 16/Dec/11 at 8:49PM]
Date Posted: Sat Dec/17/11 at 4:55pm

Akinas86
Posts: 327
Joined: 16-Jun-10

@ rav514:

the losing the game b/c of final fortune is not a state-based effect but actually a triggered effect.

704.1a. Abilities that watch for a specified game state are triggered abilities, not state-based actions. (See rule 603, “Handling Triggered Abilities.”)

so using sundial of the infinite or something like that will keep you from losing the game