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Douchey!

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MindslaverEnlarge

Mindslaver

{6}

Legendary Artifact

Scars of Mirrodin

Read rules for Mindslaver
{4}, {T}, Sacrifice Mindslaver: You control target player during that player's next turn. (You see all cards that player could see and make all decisions for them.)

Full card details & printings ›

Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 7:46 pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

Play vapors! Mindslaver someone! Activate vapors ability a billion times!
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 7:52pm

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

I don't think multiple activations will result in multiple turns lost. No matter how you slice it, it's loss of next turn only?
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 7:59pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

Nope! You can just keep putting effects on the stack! Vapors can only be destroyed once but they can lose any number of turns!
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 8:22pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

This works!

Nice one Pinkie!


[Edited by Turbine on 19/Oct/11 at 8:27PM]
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 8:38pm

Gregorius
Posts: 412
Joined: 01-Aug-10

I may be mistaken—in fact, I usually am for technical things like this—but it's my limited understanding that whenever a card references "you" in any ability, be it static or activated, it really means "the player who casts and/or controls this card".

So following that, if you use Mindslaver and have your opponent activate Lethal Vapors' ability X times, it will destroy it once but it will cause you (the controller) to skip your next X turns. For safety's sake, I would just swap out Mindslaver for Donate.
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 8:42pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

That wouldnt make any sense!

0: Destroy your opponents card and they skip a turn

I dont think so!
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 8:43pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Then, the card makes no sense. If an opponent uses the ability, they skip their turn. If you skipped your turn, then the card would be useless (less than useless)
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 8:54pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

Exactly! Then it would be
2BB: skip your next turn
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 8:57pm

Gregorius
Posts: 412
Joined: 01-Aug-10

Well, that's why I covered myself by saying "I may be mistaken". But yes, on every other card that mentions "you", it refers to the caster (of a nonpermanent spell) or controller of the card. And the updated Oracle text on Gatherer doesn't imply otherwise either...

...to avoid confusion (and cater to beginners and those who have limited understanding of how abilities work, e.g.: me), I would phrase the ability as:
": Destroy Lethal Vapors. Any player may play this ability. That player skips their next turn."
...but hey, I am wrong some, if not most times. This is how I learn—by saying idiotic things.
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 9:09pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

Sorry! I wasnt trying to call you stupid or anything, i was just trying to show you that your interpretation didnt really make sense! And i think in this case the you refers to the activator of the ability!
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 9:25pm

Gregorius
Posts: 412
Joined: 01-Aug-10

No, Pinkie, it's not you calling me stupid, it's me calling me stupid. I just had a different understanding of what the card did because the card was (as I saw it) worded in an odd way. Don't worry about it.

[Edited by Gregorius on 19/Oct/11 at 9:27PM]
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:17pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Well, I think you're all stupid, but I love you the same!
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:30pm

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

Guess it works, but this guy posted at Gatherer database about this combo:

To the guy mentionined this and mindslaver:
Most players will kill the lethal vapors in response to you activating mindslaver. Because if you control their turn while vapors is in play, you can just activate the vapors any number of times thus instantly winning the game.
Report Abuse Posted By: majinara (12/4/2009 2:31:31 PM)



At the very lest, you get him/her/it to lose a turn :) (for 2BB,6, then 4 mana).
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:34pm

Twogunkid
Posts: 2610
Joined: 22-Jan-10

maybe quicken then?
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:35pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

@ Twogun

Exactly my thoughts.
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:37pm

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

Quicken? are you balancing your checkbook? J/K... If I'm reading Quicken correctly, gives a sorcery flash... dunno if it applies.
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:38pm

Twogunkid
Posts: 2610
Joined: 22-Jan-10

You got me there pal. I guess you need leyline of anticipation then
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:39pm

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

That's the one TGK! Good call... I keep regretting trading my Ley of Ants away...
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:39pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Well, my original thought was Vedalken Orrery, but I kind of assumed that Twogun knew what he was talking about. . .
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 10:43pm

TheCaptain
Posts: 909
Joined: 13-Apr-11

You could play Mindslaver and then trickbind their attempt to destroy Lethal Vapors. Its a lot more expensive, but its an option.
Date Posted: Wed Oct/19/11 at 11:50pm

Akinas86
Posts: 327
Joined: 16-Jun-10

abeyance!!

wub wub wub modestep wubba
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 2:42am

Skippylikeno
Posts: 56
Joined: 14-Jun-11

Although it is true that turn skipping can proceed infinite times, I believe this combo still won't work. Lets say Lethal Vapors's ability is activated by the player, i dunno, 2 billion times. Only the first one would cause a turn skip because once the first on the stack is resolved, the enchantment Is destroyed and the rest on the stack fail. If the turn skip was a part of the cost of the ability, this would totally work, but unfortunatly it doesn't.
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 2:48am

Skippylikeno
Posts: 56
Joined: 14-Jun-11

Actually wait! I'm stupid. It could totally work since destroying isn't apart of the cost either (at first glance I thought it was). My bad!
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 10:27am

TheCaptain
Posts: 909
Joined: 13-Apr-11

Pithing Needle. And a way to get rid of it.
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 10:39am

lin sivvi
Posts: 1608
Joined: 14-Jan-10

Brilliant captain
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 1:28pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Oxidize!
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 1:42pm

Gizmo5579
Posts: 6
Joined: 23-Jun-11

Assuming that you could pull off playing lethal vapors and using Mindslaver to control opponents next turn without them activating vapors ability before you actually use their next turn, the wording would indicate you only skip 1 turn no matter how many times you activate it. Yes you can have multiple instances on the stack, but the stack would resolve before the current turn is over, and every resolution reads skip the "next" turn. No matter how many times you say it, the next turn is lost, so it's not like saying you lose your next turn, then you lose the next turn after that then the next turn after that. Either way, it's the "next turn" whether that turn has already been lost or not...right?
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 4:25pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

NO, YOU KEEP LOSING TURNS! WEVE ESTABLISHED THIS! Also, best solution is vedalken orrery!
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 4:50pm

gericault5
Posts: 2788
Joined: 13-Oct-09

@gizmo

let me layman term it out for you, it'll be easier,

First your turn structure

A is your next turn, B is the turn after that, C is the turn after that, D is the turn after that, etc....

activate the vapors abililty now you skip A since its your next turn,  so know your turn structure looks like this

A is skipped, B is your next turn, C is the turn after that, D is the turn after that, etc....

Activate vapors skip B since its your next turn.  so now...

A is skipped, B is skipped, C is your next turn, D is the turn after that, etc....

and so on...

 
Date Posted: Thu Oct/20/11 at 5:23pm

PinkiePie
Posts: 157
Joined: 10-Sep-11

Thanks gerry!




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