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Combo Name: buh bye library Submitted By: Draco_lich
Card Name
Type
Cost
P/T
Editions (ordered by release)

Bitter Ordeal
 Sorcery 2B Future Sight, Rare

Traumatize
 Sorcery 3UU Odyssey, Rare
Estimated Combo Cost: $2.36
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 11:52 am

Draco_lich
Posts: 1073
Joined: 07-May-10

save mana for bitter ordeal..
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 11:53am

Draco_lich
Posts: 1073
Joined: 07-May-10

add haunting echoes for more fun
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 2:28pm

Eldraziking187
Posts: 670
Joined: 12-Apr-10

2 islands, a swamp and 2 Dark Rits FTW!!! Great combo!
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 3:58pm

Decay57
Posts: 14
Joined: 19-Jan-11

This combo doesnt work. Gravestorm only works on PERMANENTS going into the graveyard and only cards in play are considered permanents.

Bitter Ordeal + Pox is a better use of Gravestorm.
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 4:11pm

Eldraziking187
Posts: 670
Joined: 12-Apr-10

well it would have been nice but thats true. I would just run Traumatize with keening stone. there are lots of ways to get the stone out fast. I always used explorer map with the urza lands. thats 7 colorless alone.
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 4:26pm

Draco_lich
Posts: 1073
Joined: 07-May-10

this combo does work and here is the proof

by definition a permanant is anything that is not an instant, instant or sorcery in magic (and not cards in hand) cards in the grave can still be permanents, otherwise some cards (newer cards too) have no use at all

like the one that reads "return target permanent card from your graveyard to your hand" (natures spiral for example)Nature's Spiral

or sun titan is useless if cards in graveyard can not be a permanent

All objects that remain on the battlefield are called permanents. Types of permanents include lands, creatures, enchantments, artifacts, and planeswalkers. In contrast, sorceries and instants go to the graveyard immediately after they are used
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic:_The_Gathering_rules
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 4:43pm

Eldraziking187
Posts: 670
Joined: 12-Apr-10

True:

110.4a The term "permanent card" is used to refer to a card that could be put onto the battlefield. Specifically, it means an artifact, creature, enchantment, land, or planeswalker card.

110.4b The term "permanent spell" is used to refer to a spell that will enter the battlefield as a permanent as part of its resolution. Specifically, it means an artifact, creature, enchantment, or planeswalker spell.

110.4c If a permanent somehow loses all its permanent types, it remains on the battlefield. It's still a permanent.

Via Comp rules. I was wrong, I eat crow.
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 4:45pm

gericault5
Posts: 2788
Joined: 13-Oct-09

Draco- you are right a permanent is not an instant or sorcery, and that it is an enchantment, creature, artifact, planeswalker, and land, basically the things that stay in play after they are cast.

But you might have noticed on both examples you give, natures spiral and sun titan, they don't look for a permanent, they look for a permanent card. 

Permanents on exist on the battlefield in all other zones they are ______ cards, look at Aluran, it doesn't say play creatures it says creature card, it does become a creature until it enters play

 

Edit:  started typeing before eldrazi had his post sorry


[Edited by gericault5 on 19/Jan/11 at 4:47PM]
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 5:06pm

Decay57
Posts: 14
Joined: 19-Jan-11

110.1. A permanent is a card or token on the battlefield. A permanent remains on the battlefield
indefinitely. A card or token becomes a permanent as it enters the battlefield
and it stops being a permanent as it’s moved to another zone by an effect or rule.




Or better yet, teh gravestorm rulings:

702.66a Gravestorm is a triggered ability that functions on the stack. “Gravestorm” means “When you cast this spell, put a copy of it onto the stack for each permanent that was put into a graveyard from the battlefield this turn. If the spell has any targets, you may choose new targets for any of the copies.”









[Edited by Decay57 on 19/Jan/11 at 5:14PM]

Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 6:27pm

krowbar28
Posts: 434
Joined: 18-Oct-10

 


[Edited by krowbar28 on 19/Jan/11 at 6:31PM]
Date Posted: Wed Jan/19/11 at 9:10pm

Eldraziking187
Posts: 670
Joined: 12-Apr-10

 

@gericault5: huh?

You guys are so smart. It makes sence both ways but the last couple of post really put it into prospective. I would never know half this shit ya'll talk about on here and it just goes to show, I have been playing this game *counting fingers* 16 years and I don't know this about the wording of permanent and permanent card. Thanks for the lesson. I am a damn good player and I try to learn everything about any card I like and decide to play with before I play it. If there is something I don't understand, I reseach and study.  I have taught new players the basics of the game just to find in a years time that they have exceled much further than me and I used to find that frustrating until one day I understood, I'm avarage IQ and they are above that. I'm not afraid to admit  when I am wrong and I love it when someone tries to show me the right way to play. If I don't agree at first, I want proof but I've stopped getting angry and trying to win an argument over a small rule in a giant game. It's taken a long time in my life to become this way and I have to say, this website has helped with that for me. I have gathered so much info from you all and I just wanted to say "I appriciate it". gericault5, you have been more of a help to not just me but to alot of people on here. More so for me than but a small handful of people/judges/professionals that I know in real life (conceded jerk faces). Thanks dude. I wanna play a game againt you and the awsomeness that I'm sure you build.

Everyone could use this lesson even if thier mindset is already there, the reminder can be nice. Stay positive no matter what life throws at ya'. Getting pissed or upset just because you were wrong and some kids pointing out your mistake in front of everyone sayin " your deck doesn't work" will surely shorten your life (I've been there many times).  I find that the best way to deal with this is to say "thanks for the help dude" to them. Not only does this confuse them due to the fact that they are use to the negative/defensive reaction that most give but Magic is for fun, not to make enemies. If you play this game I love than we have a huge thing in common already.

Ok, thats it, life story over. No more Dr. Phil moments for atleast another month.



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