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Title: Question?

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Date Posted: Mon May/24/10 at 11:09am

Posts: 98
Joined: 28-Apr-10

OK, can you kill a creature that can produce mana (Lanowar Elf for example) in response to it taping for mana? Or, b/c its a mana source, can it not be "countered" by killing the creature?

Date Posted: Mon May/24/10 at 11:14am

Zark-the-Damned

Posts: 523
Joined: 24-Feb-10

1. Tapping a Llanowar Elf for mana is a Mana ability, and does not use the stack, so you cannot respond to it.

2. Even if you could respond to it, killing the Elf would not stop your opponent gaining the mana. Once played, abilities on the stack operate independently of their source (the hand grenade rule - you can't stop a grenade by shooting the soldier who threw it).

Date Posted: Mon May/24/10 at 11:29am

Posts: 98
Joined: 28-Apr-10

Date Posted: Mon May/24/10 at 3:18pm

Posts: 33
Joined: 20-May-10

But, say you swords a vinny after he tapped to kill your tapped creature. That stops the vinny from killing your creature right?

Date Posted: Mon May/24/10 at 11:53pm

Posts: 2788
Joined: 13-Oct-09

vinney is a new term for me, but if we use royal assassin for an example if he taps to kill a tap creature an is then terminated his ability is still on the stack so your creature dies when it resolves.

[Edited by gericault5 on 24/May/10 at 11:54PM]

Date Posted: Tue May/25/10 at 2:28am

Posts: 5711
Joined: 08-Sep-09

What's a vinny?

Date Posted: Tue May/25/10 at 6:43am

Zark-the-Damned

Posts: 523
Joined: 24-Feb-10

Did you even read my post DuffCapers?

'2. Even if you could respond to it, killing the Elf would not stop your opponent gaining the mana. Once played, abilities on the stack operate independently of their source (the hand grenade rule - you can't stop a grenade by shooting the soldier who threw it).'

Assuming by Vinny, you mean Royal Assassin (or similar), killing the Assassin does not stop the ability. You would have to untap the target or give it prot: black.

Date Posted: Tue May/25/10 at 9:07am

Posts: 33
Joined: 20-May-10

Sorry - yes...Vinny is a term for the Royal Assassin, just like Tim is the prodigal sorcerer...but whatever, maybe I'm just getting old.

I did read your post, and am not talking about mana abilities, as those work outside the stack. I was referring to a question (which I have now posted in the "questions" thread, so I won't go into detail here) about the stack and how we have ALWAYS played it, and how I'm pretty sure it used to work, when/why/how it changed I don't know...anyway...small example.

PLAYER 1
Royal Assassin

PLAYER 2
Tapped Hill Giant and lightning bolt in hand

P1 Taps assassin to kill giant, P2 responds with lightning bolt to the assassin. Our resolve was always Assassin dies, Giant lives, because the assassin isn't around when it comes to his "turn" on the stack.

Date Posted: Tue May/25/10 at 11:13am

Posts: 1250
Joined: 31-Aug-09

when a creature uses an ability other than a mana ability, the ability goes on the stack. At that point the ability on the stack is independent of the creature that originated it. Killing the creature doesn't remove the ability form the stack. Also you can't respond to a cost being payed. For instance if i sac a creature as part of an ability or spell, you can't play a destroy target creature on it, because it is sac while i hold the active player. The movement of a creatue card to the graveyard occurs without priorty passing to the other player. The spell or effect doesn't resolve until the priorty has been passed to the other player, and back, without the other player doing anything. That is there chance to respond.

Date Posted: Tue May/25/10 at 7:50pm

Posts: 5711
Joined: 08-Sep-09

Well, pretty much everything about the question is explained here...

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