Skip to content
MTGCombos
MenuClose

Share your combos and save your decks.

Join for freeLog in
Magic The Gathering Combos
Search Cards & Combos:

Home     Submit A Combo     Deck Builder     Forums     Picture Guess     Help

You are not logged in [click to login] - [Join For Free!]  





Title: What constitutes a win
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 7:32am

Memnite Shyamalan
Posts: 81
Joined: 26-Dec-11

Ok, so my wife and I play against each other every so often. She believes that cards like Mortal Combat, Near Death Experience, and Darksteel Reactor are BS because it's "not really winning". My beef is that if you cleverly meet the winning conditions met on the card then it's a win. She's all about burn and big creatures (she doesn't get out much in a MtG sense).

Arguing with her about using legal combos and cards to win gets frustrating since she must have a head made of Darksteel. I just wanted to rant a little. She just doesn't know the power of the darkside of the force!
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 9:44am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

A win is reducing someone to 0 or less life, having an opponent draw a card with no cards in their library, or meeting the conditions of a card that lets you win the game.
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 10:07am

SirZapdos
Posts: 329
Joined: 21-Jun-11

Those are all perfectly valid ways to win. Winning with cards like Near Death Experience, Barren Glory and Mortal Combat takes a good amount of both luck and skill.

On the other hand, if you're playing EDH when someone drops a Felidar Sovereign on turn 3, I would agree with your wife. That is a hollow victory.


[Edited by SirZapdos on 19/Mar/12 at 10:07AM]
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 10:21am

Boyachi
Posts: 1553
Joined: 02-Nov-11

I've run into many people, my fiancee included, that don't enjoy the more mechanical ways of winning/losing. This group is typically causal play.

I think what it comes down to is the level of challenge. I formulated my red deck to run on (not necessarily need) two mountains and a very diverse sideboard. My white deck barely needs its own sideboard but has one anyway. My reanimation deck (thanks to you guys!) has no sideboard as it has a way to basically deal with any threat/hoser. My point is, once I start making a deck I want to make tourney worthy, I pour through the details to manage its weakpoints. Many people don't want to put that much work into something they do casually.

Cards with win conditions are very hard to deal with if you aren't A) expecting them or B) playing blue control. Many people think that cards that have that great of an effect are unfair. It throws the challenge curve up too high and too quickly.

I recommend doing what I ended up doing with my fiancee and those friends was to stop playing those decks (or at least the most annoying ones) and just used my more "basic" decks.

End of the day, I play Magic to have fun, but 99% I also enjoy the company of the people I face. If you love your wife like I love my fiancee, get a game winning hand and then play a few extra turns to see if she can win. You'll know that you already won, but she'll have the satisfaction. You obviously don't have to do this every time, but once and a while its okay to let people win.

It is better to lose a game in Magic than to lose a Magic player that you also love.

PS: Rules state that the card has priority over the rules. So, yes, you are right: winning is winning.


[Edited by Boyachi on 19/Mar/12 at 10:22AM]
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 10:24am

Starship
Posts: 549
Joined: 13-Dec-11

i know that a lot of play groups ban infinite combos and awesome cards like sun quan, but to me a win is a win and some are just more fun than others.
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 12:00pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

The knowledge that you won is always more important than actually winning.

The search for knowledge is important than the rewards.
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 12:56pm

darthnefas
Posts: 1081
Joined: 04-Apr-11

I'm just not a fan of the many list of cards that say, "you win". I think the game could be a lot more creative with things like poison counters (which no one has brought up), damage, mill, to make a another win condition, instead of just saying, "put some counters on this card and you win".
Date Posted: Mon Mar/19/12 at 6:01pm

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

The trouble is getting the effects to trigger. Mayael's Aria, for example. How often are you going to get a 20/20?
Date Posted: Thu Mar/22/12 at 2:31pm

Squillis
Posts: 424
Joined: 20-Nov-08

I think the thing that people have against these cards is that there is often few ways to win, leading to many seemingly repeated games.  When you are going in with creatures and burn, you are always dealing damage in differing amounts and times.  When you play around the win-condition of a card little can seem different if your opponent can't see how you had to play it differently than every other time.
Date Posted: Thu Mar/22/12 at 10:11pm

lin sivvi
Posts: 1608
Joined: 14-Jan-10

I would say that the difference between a "win" and a "WIN!!!"

Killing someone with goats is a "WIN!!!"

Killing someone turn 5 with burn spells is a "win"

Beating someone by pulling painter's servant/grindstone is a "win"

Beating someone who has infinite life is a "WIN!!!"