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Title: Rules question from FNM!
Date Posted: Mon Jan/10/11 at 3:21pm

W@W Podcaster
Posts: 445
Joined: 01-Jun-10

Okay, so this happened at my local store: Joe has 9 poison counters. He is playing against Mark. Mark has 1 card in his library. It is Joe's turn. Joe passes the turn. Mark draws steady progress. If he plays it, what happens?
Date Posted: Mon Jan/10/11 at 7:42pm

Bladelord00
Posts: 112
Joined: 13-Nov-08

I believe because you proliferate before you draw Mark Wins the game
Date Posted: Mon Jan/10/11 at 8:12pm

Pal-of-Lim-Dul
Posts: 1148
Joined: 24-May-10

Sounds right to me...
Date Posted: Mon Jan/10/11 at 8:39pm

Icuonuez
Posts: 241
Joined: 02-Mar-10

This is true. Because in the game of magic, when you cast a spell, any effect that can't be performed on a spell fizzle's. So since you proliferate, causing the opponent to lose the game, since the game is no longer being played, you can't draw a card.
Date Posted: Mon Jan/10/11 at 9:02pm

W@W Podcaster
Posts: 445
Joined: 01-Jun-10

Wow, am I really wrong about this? I actually went to the game and made the ruling that Joe wins. If I'm not wrong, then "A player with ten or more poison counters loses the game." is a state-based action. Joe gets a counter, putting him at ten, then Mark has to draw from an empty library, making him lose. Once the spell is done resolving, the game sees that Joe has ten counters, and makes him lose, but Mark already lost, so that doesn't matter. Am I right or not, because the outcome of the tournament hinged on this? Most of the people there agreed with me though.
Date Posted: Mon Jan/10/11 at 9:07pm

gericault5
Posts: 2788
Joined: 13-Oct-09

Losing the game via poison counters or losing by the inability to draw a card are both determined by state base actions.  State based actions are determined whenever a player gets priority.  However, nobody gets priority while a spell is resolving, so by the time SBE's are checked joe has 10 poison counters and Mark has tried to draw from an empty library.  SBE's the occur as a single event.

End result both players lose simultaneously, its a draw
Date Posted: Tue Jan/11/11 at 1:27am

Ephemerance
Posts: 913
Joined: 18-Jun-09

Gericault is correct.
Date Posted: Mon Jan/24/11 at 9:45pm

shakii23
Posts: 5711
Joined: 08-Sep-09

Really now...

I thought that the moment Joe has 10 counters, he immediately loses...
Date Posted: Tue Jan/25/11 at 4:08am

Zark-the-Damned
Posts: 523
Joined: 24-Feb-10

Nope, you only lose next time state based actions are checked, which is after the spell has finished resolving.
Date Posted: Tue Jan/25/11 at 7:17am

Turbine
Posts: 10194
Joined: 26-Oct-09

Yeah, so ther drawing ability and the proliferate ability resolve at the same time, then, right?
Date Posted: Tue Jan/25/11 at 8:04am

Zark-the-Damned
Posts: 523
Joined: 24-Feb-10

Correct.

The spell resolves and tries to do everything it can (gives a poison counter and tries to draw it's controller a card).

While it is resolving, the game doesn't care about the empty library or 10 counters.

Once it has finished resolving, the active player would gain priority - so state based actions kick in and see that one player has 10 poison counters, and another attempted to draw from an empty library. Both players lose simultaneously. Since all players have lost, the game ends as a draw.